@enkiv2 the wider problem with tolerating/accepting recreational use of psychedelics in some countries/societies (i.e UK) might seem initially unrelated - car dependency, busy lives and crowded city environments.

LSD and other psychedelics have *very* long after effects, and its near impossible for a professional British person to live without having to drive, cycle or get on a crowded train/metro.

None of these are any fun at all (and can possibly even be unsafe) if still tripping..

@vfrmedia @enkiv2
Hmmm... LSD goes through the system in 8-12 hours, right? I'd expect most folks who can afford a dose can also afford to stay indoors for a day over the weekend (or failing that, a bank holiday).

@enkiv2 this is scientifically true, but LSD (in UK) is not especially expensive (per dose its way cheaper than MDMA, or cocaine) though on pre internet markets its availability was often sporadic.

The UK's DUI limit is 1µg/L of blood. I do not know if long term microdosing would cause a user to exceed this limit.

British people (especially younger people) often live in smaller houses making parties/gatherings harder (noise restrictions, housemates may not agree with drugs use in house etc)

@vfrmedia @enkiv2
I have a sneaking suspicion that microdosing's dynamics are different. Microdosing by definition uses a fraction of the minimum effective tripping dose, & tolerance in LSD is extreme (weeks of tolerance after a single threshhold dose), so microdosing tolerance probably lowers the effects of microdosing itself.

@enkiv2 @vfrmedia
LSD seems like a really strange choice for a party drug. I'd expect most people to take it alone or with one or two housemates as sitters.

@enkiv2 I've had to "rescue" a few people who overdid it (and the 2-c* type psychedelics, sometimes both at once) at outdoor raves!

A surreal consequence of my ancestry (SE Asian) and ethnic stereotypes here is that folk (who know I work in healthcare) somehow assume I can fix both computers *and* people (OK the casualties recovered but I didn't even do any medical stuff, just reassured their friends and told them to look after them until they calmed down)

@vfrmedia @enkiv2
Man, that sounds like an absolute recipe for bad trips. I can understand taking MDMA in a social context, but anything with a head-trip seems like a bad combination with loud & crowded settings. (But, people make a lot of poor decisions in conjunction with entheogens...)

@enkiv2 I was genuinely dismayed at just how quickly we Brits pissed up the wall a chance to have a tolerated recreational drugs market, and at least in the initial stages it was educated young people buying the so-called "research chemicals" online and experimenting.

The cops didn't even *want* to bust this market as it had nearly eliminated street dealing amongst these groups (which today leads to a lot of nasty violence) but couldn't cope with DUI and extra burdens on the NHS

@vfrmedia @enkiv2 Do people who microdose have occasional dosage accidents? Where they are just getting their morning coffee from Starbucks and go, "Hmmm, I don't think I'm going to be able to go to work today".

@jbond @vfrmedia @enkiv2
I have heard folks accidentally dosing a nearly threshhold dose & getting a bit dizzy/loopy when first starting. I suspect it gets harder to reach that over time. If you're having a tenth of a normal dose every other day, you're probably not going to be able to trip if you try after the first week.

personal experience, not advisable 

@jbond @enkiv2

Depending on the job it might be relatively easy to conceal the state you are in.

After a particularly heavy party I was still tripping on Monday and wentto work where I had to fix a jumper wire to a complex circuit board with surface mount technology

I ended up first picking up the soldering iron by the *hot* end; but after the pain subsided was still able to successfully do this and finish the day and was not too badly injured >>

personal experience, not advisable 

@jbond @enkiv2

ofc still a workplace injury (it hurt more a few days after!) and it was a good thing I didn't even ride a bike then let alone drive as that could have increased the risks to other innocent parties (which I think is the real risk from microdosing or any substance use) - I expect in construction or other physical work you would have to take extra care too..

personal experience, not advisable 

@vfrmedia @enkiv2 There's only been a very, very few times when I've been unable to ride a bicycle. Usually involving alcohol and kids bicycles.

@enkiv2 some further context about UK drugs culture - from about 2008 to 2016 there were a *ton* of strong drugs available unrestricted online (no more than Amazon purchase) in our country, from stimulants to downers and *effective* LSD equivalents.

The then govt simply looked the other way for about 5 years.

Alas people binged on all of them big time and various casualties piled up that the NHS had to deal with (very few deaths, but a lot of scares and chronic health problems) >>


so we Brits (unintentionally) *had* a social experiment with a self regulated recreational drugs market for serveral years, but fucked it up bad.

which is a big shame as there were plenty of people giving good harm reduction advice on forums etc (I was one of them) but the binge culture and short term thinking in this country won out in the end...

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