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osnews.com/story/132975/think-

"Wayland solves no issues I have but breaks almost everything I need. And usually it stays broken, because the Wayland folks only seem to care about Gnome, and alienating everyone else in the process. "

This whole thing is thoroughly scary, not from a technical point of view but looking at the picture of the FLOSS community it is creating. 😐

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@z428 Really not sure why a site like OSNews would be posting this (aside from the click-bait). It certainly isn't news-worthy. Would they cover someone who still uses WinXP ranting about how Windows 10 "breaks everything"? Or someone complaining about recent Linux kernel versions breaking their ipchains scripts so they're still running 2.2?

Like anti-systemd cranks, best we just let children like that have a cry to themselves in the corner and get on with life imho.

@mjog Personal guess is that Thom stumbled across this and ended up so pi___d that he wrote about it. πŸ˜‰

My issue with all these things, be that wayland or systemd or whatever kind of technology, is: Either it is just me and these things becoming more obvious or the community is becoming more and more polarized and hostile towards such changes. Taking that ipchains/iptables example, I can't recall people being *that* upset about this change back then. Somehow it feels like people are ...

@mjog ... increasingly anti-social and unable to collaborate in a way that, then and now, would require acknowledging an other point of view to be valid too even though one doesn't like it. 😐

@mjog (The linked article with features not yet around in wayland surely *does* however draw a somewhat bleak picture. In a "real-world" project, one possibly would let such a project grow to a point where it is > 80% complete and only _then_ start rolling it out step-by-step. 😐 )

@z428 Yup, definitely a worrying trend. I feel like there's a lot of parallels with the general increase in intolerance irl, tbh.

@z428 Still, that guy's list is basically "screen recording is broken" (it was for a while, but that's been fixed) and "Redshift is broken" (except that GNOME added equivalent functionality years ago), which is hardly 80%. To provide some contradictory annecdata: I've been using Wayland day-to-day for something like three or four years and it's been totally fine.

@z428 Incidentally, I have been subscribed to the Redshift bug covering lack of support for Wayland since basically day one, and it's best characterised as a lot of people complaining Wayland and no-one (including the maintainer) doing anything about it, so it's hardly surprising it never got fixed.

@mjog Seems like the ever-occurring issue: "Something's broken - so wayland/systemd/<insert-whatever> needs to fix that to be compatible with <old-tech> again".

@mjog I'm using it then and now (it seems), haven't so far apparently found anything that broke this way. There's still a backward-compatibility issue with Linux desktops in general but that's not just something wayland is to blame for - like why can I install and run a 25-year old binary on Windows but fail to install and run a 6-year old binary on a Linux desktop distribution? πŸ˜‰

@z428 Yeah it's funny, we don't have the problem of trying to support 25 year old binaries like MS does, yet some people can't let go of 50 year old init systems and 40 year old display servers.

@mjog True. πŸ™‚ But, too, we are missing out on either culture or process to come to a consensus of what we use to replace these decades-old legacy. At this point, we're currently far off from what seems the strength of FLOSS (collaboration over competition). 😐

@mjog Yes, indeed. Seems a totally broken culture of communication in too many places, not just the political mainstream.

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